Boxing, Kicking in WMA

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Postby Monster Zero » 22 Aug 2006 21:22

J Marwood wrote:+1 Jon. I know of a number of very good punchers who are very effective. However, they have all had fairly nasty hand injuries (huge abcess from a shard of tooth anyone?).


If the tooth broke you'd get an abcess on an open handed strike too.
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Postby Carlo » 22 Aug 2006 21:23

Maybe I've shitty hands, but in the years of punching practice I've temporarily incapacitaed one of my hands a few times. Maybe not really broken, but when I'm not able to shoot at my best, or hadle an edged weapon properly because of a technique... Replaced.

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Postby Monster Zero » 22 Aug 2006 21:25

You put the thumbs inside your palm don't you... ;P
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Postby Stunt Weasel » 22 Aug 2006 21:31

Before I understood the mechanics well I used to feel it in my wrists and knuckles a lot on hard punches, but I've never been hurt punching since I learned to punch properly. Uppercuts tend to still scrape up my knuckles when hitting into a pad however ...

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Postby Monster Zero » 22 Aug 2006 21:36

Stunt Weasel wrote:Before I understood the mechanics well I used to feel it in my wrists and knuckles a lot on hard punches, but I've never been hurt punching since I learned to punch properly. Uppercuts tend to still scrape up my knuckles when hitting into a pad however ...

Mario


Exactly!

And yeah, uppercuts do tend to lead to bloody knuckles.
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Postby J Marwood » 22 Aug 2006 21:39

The problem I have is that I tend to miss under stress - meaning I impct with the wrong part of my hands. For example I have a recurring injury to my right thumb from a guy who partially ducked a cross meanding I hit the top of his head with my thumb
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Postby Alina » 22 Aug 2006 21:40

Ouch!
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And the land where the yew tree grows.
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Postby Stunt Weasel » 22 Aug 2006 22:11

J Marwood wrote:The problem I have is that I tend to miss under stress - meaning I impct with the wrong part of my hands. For example I have a recurring injury to my right thumb from a guy who partially ducked a cross meanding I hit the top of his head with my thumb

Maybe you should shoot your punches to the body more then.

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Postby Carlo » 22 Aug 2006 22:25

Monster 0 wrote: You put the thumbs inside your palm don't you... ;P


Nope, I put my index inside my nose :lol:

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Postby Carlo » 22 Aug 2006 22:28

Mario wrote


Indeed, I'd punch for the solar plexus, floating ribs, liver, hara and kidneys, everything else with edge of the hand or plam.

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Postby Stunt Weasel » 22 Aug 2006 22:35

If you strike with the edge of your hand or your palm, then it's not a punch, Carlo. ;)

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Postby J Marwood » 22 Aug 2006 23:18

Stunt Weasel wrote:Maybe you should shoot your punches to the body more then.

Mario


I'm looking to attack the CNS and put him/them down ASAP - body shots are not really effective for that IME.

If the body is all that is available then I'll take it but otherwise I'm a headhunter ;)
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Postby Carlo » 22 Aug 2006 23:46

Mario said: If you strike with the edge of your hand or your palm, then it's not a punch, Carlo.


Ok let's reformulate in a clearer way

There are two sets considered

A) things I would punch: (solar plexus, floating ribs, liver, hara and kidneys)
B) things I'd hit with edge or palm: ( everything else )

A and B would apply only to those cases in which I'm dumb enough not to have improvised or accessed a weapon yet, because it's not the case that I'm a fan of fair play.

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Postby Peregrine Dace » 23 Aug 2006 07:47

Hey Angel
Had the same problem for a while from mitt work on my right last knuckle. I found this was a result of two problems. The first was that Ihad lateral motion at the ed of the impact and the fist was skimming slightly on the mitt. The other was that my partner was holdng the mitt with a flat face, rather than slightly angled in which exacerbated my error. So in Ascii graphics the underescore is the mitt face while the backslash is the angle of my cross.
___
\
(and no I won't be able to control the angle of my opponent's head but I sure as hell wont be crossing like that to a flat surface either)

So focus on smacking into the mitt rather than moving across the surface.

As for vertical/horizontal. yes well, heard both arguments for far to long to hing there's all that much in it.

Enjoy your day all
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Postby Stunt Weasel » 23 Aug 2006 07:58

J Marwood wrote:I'm looking to attack the CNS and put him/them down ASAP - body shots are not really effective for that IME. If the body is all that is available then I'll take it but otherwise I'm a headhunter.

The problem with that, of course, is that you say you keep missing the head with your punches. ;)

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Postby J Marwood » 23 Aug 2006 09:30

No, I don't miss the head, I impact with the wrong part of my hand. Under stress I find open hand blows and hammer fists to be more reliable and less damaging to me. Punches require a level of accuracy that I know from experience is difficult to maintain.
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Postby Monster Zero » 23 Aug 2006 14:59

J Marwood wrote:No, I don't miss the head, I impact with the wrong part of my hand. Under stress I find open hand blows and hammer fists to be more reliable and less damaging to me. Punches require a level of accuracy that I know from experience is difficult to maintain.


You need to practice target recognition with a partner then.

Use focus mitts...
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Postby Paul » 23 Aug 2006 15:03

Monster Zero wrote:
J Marwood wrote:No, I don't miss the head, I impact with the wrong part of my hand. Under stress I find open hand blows and hammer fists to be more reliable and less damaging to me. Punches require a level of accuracy that I know from experience is difficult to maintain.


You need to practice target recognition with a partner then.

Use focus mitts...


The question remains whether that accuracy remains available under stress.
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Postby Monster Zero » 23 Aug 2006 15:06

Paul wrote:The question remains whether that accuracy remains available under stress.


And that's why you train.

The best thing about focus mitt training is your partner can pop you with them when you drop your guard. :wink:
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Postby J Marwood » 23 Aug 2006 16:17

Good advice Thom and you are quite correct - that kind of drilling is exactly what I need. I do this in stress drill when I am able but the nature of the training makes it impossible to do on the village green where most of my current partner practice takes place.

That said, I am not convinced of the advantages closed fist strikes have over open ones. I try to use the body mechanics from boxing for most of my hand strikes, although my skill in this area is deficient.

One thing I do want to clarify is that I am not saying that everyone should disregard closed first strikes - I have had good success in using these in the past with most of my real world KOs coming from right hooks or crosses. However I think open hand strikes are, for me, a higher percentage option and so what I focus on.

For training body movement and sheer hitting power I do not know anything which equals boxing (although I know Alina has had good success with various internal Chinese arts - I have no direct experience) so I think the fact that Angel is doing this is A Good Thing.
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