Boxing, Kicking in WMA

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Boxing, Kicking in WMA

Postby Angel S. » 20 Aug 2006 23:23

Right so we're starting to do more boxing & kickboxing type stuff at practice and holy hell it's not easy. I really dig it though and I'm not as bad as i thought I would be. Of course I'm not as good as I should be either but you gotta start somewhere right?

Ok so I got some good hits in on the lads but I got really tired & found it hard to keep my hands up after a while. I got tossed about a lot but I picked up the blocking a bit so I can't complain. Besides they've done some form of boxing before and this is really my first time. I'm not used to hitting people in the face or being hit but I like it (of course I was wearing a face mask but hey).

My kicks are pretty good though but my knuckles are now bleeding & swollen. I was explaining this to Rawlings & he said it sounds like I'm not hitting straight on. Does anyone have a boxing video that would help me out with this? I think if I can see how it's done over & over I can practice at home.

Any tips would be great too.
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Postby Alina » 20 Aug 2006 23:27

From my understanding, bare knuckle boxers usually hit with the knuckles vertical whereas modern boxers hit with the knuckles in a horizontal position. Hitting with vertical knuckles would probably help you to avoid cuts. The other option, and one I've seen in Okinawan Goju-Ryu Karate is to hit with the knuckles horizontally but maintain a very slight downward angle on the wrist which causes the knuckles to hit more flush. I wouldn't advise doing the latter without seeing it demo'd first though, cuz it could end up giving you a broken wrist if you aren't doing it properly.
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Postby Carlo » 21 Aug 2006 11:42

I used to do bare fist practice on a saw dust filled boxing bag (daily), a medic friend of mine observed: "You're after artritis, aren't you?".
I don't believe in punches a bit (not above the solar plexus), I use only palm strikes and side of the hand blows. Have you noticed the scarcity of punches in medieval and renaissance works?

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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 12:07

If you are punching someone in the fencing mask, then I think some light gloves would be a good idea.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 15:09

Buy a pair of bag gloves.

Your group really should be using bag gloves and focus mitts.
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Postby Angel S. » 21 Aug 2006 15:24

Monster Zero wrote:Buy a pair of bag gloves.

Your group really should be using bag gloves and focus mitts.


Well I was doing bare knuckle on the mitts but MMA gloves on the light sparring.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 15:35

That should give adequate protection.

I'd suggest getting some boxing headgear rather than using masks though.

It does take time to deaden the knuckles.

I would start slowly on your own, punching something light, then work your way up.

I'm currently doing 1/2 speed/power on steel posts.
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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 15:36

Monster Zero wrote:Buy a pair of bag gloves.

Your group really should be using bag gloves and focus mitts.


Why?

Gloves are only good if you want to punch people in the face without them wearing protection. IMHO.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 15:45

Simple Paul:

They allow you to throw more punches and practice longer.

It's not about "Raaaaggghhhh me have fists of steel" it's about learning how to throw a good punch and building timing.
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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 15:59

Gloves are heavy, so people get tired sooner and therefore practice shorter.

Blocking punches also becomes much easier when the opponent is wearing gloves, so timing becomes less crucial.

:wink:
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Postby Angel S. » 21 Aug 2006 16:02

Paul wrote:Gloves are heavy, so people get tired sooner and therefore practice shorter.

Blocking punches also becomes much easier when the opponent is wearing gloves, so timing becomes less crucial.

:wink:


I didn't find mine to be heavy at all. How does it become easier to block punches with gloves? I didn't think so at least.
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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 16:05

Ungloved fists need a much smaller opening then gloved fists. And because the fists of the attacker are bigger with gloves, it's easier for the defender to hit them.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 16:23

And that's why all professional boxers use them for training... :roll:

1. the extra weight they add is negligable and if anything increases your punching speed and power when not wearing gloves.

2. You don't need to wear them for everything if you don't want to.

3. They really, really help.
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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 16:52

Monster Zero wrote:And that's why all professional boxers use them for training... :roll:
Professional boxes use them because they also have to use them in their matches. :wink:

Monster Zero wrote:1. the extra weight they add is negligable and if anything increases your punching speed and power when not wearing gloves.
I guess you have a point there. We sometimes use them for exactly this reason.

But it can also lead to bad habits because it makes punches easier to block. So I think you should only use them when hitting a pad or bag. And perhaps sometimes in sparring if you want to make the head a viable target.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 17:01

Paul wrote:But it can also lead to bad habits because it makes punches easier to block. So I think you should only use them when hitting a pad or bag. And perhaps sometimes in sparring if you want to make the head a viable target.


You mean you spar without the head being a viable target?

That sounds a hell of a lot less effective than using gloves...
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Postby Paul » 21 Aug 2006 17:17

Monster Zero wrote:
Paul wrote:But it can also lead to bad habits because it makes punches easier to block. So I think you should only use them when hitting a pad or bag. And perhaps sometimes in sparring if you want to make the head a viable target.


You mean you spar without the head being a viable target?

That sounds a hell of a lot less effective than using gloves...


Sparring is always purely educational, and never competition. Head and crotch are touch only, to force people to cover those areas. The rest of the body is fair game.

It's a compromise, and I think it's preferable to always sparring with gloves. Sometimes we do spar with gloves, and I think that ideally one should do both, as both teach different useful things.

The main advantage of sparring with gloves is that you can afford to become more aggressive, as a hit on the head (intentionally or accidentally, by you or your opponent) doesn't mean instant KO. The disadvantage is the unrealistic blocking as I mentioned earlier.

International PS match rules include chest protectors, no hits to the head or crotch and no gloves.
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 17:32

Our sparring is pretty much live.

And goes for 3 2-minute rounds.

Knockout, getting folks to quit, or decision are all ways to win.
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JKD Gloves

Postby Jeffrey Hull » 21 Aug 2006 18:20

Angel:

I agree with Alina and Carlo.

I would only add a recommendation for JKD gloves. Permutations of that design are made by various outfiitters, you could find a permutation to suit you. They are not heavy and bloated like modern boxing gloves. Such design gives you some independence amongst the fingers, and allow you to grapple, and let you pick up and use wasters and blunts.

Good luck,
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Postby Monster Zero » 21 Aug 2006 18:32

I've been studying JKD for nearly 3 years now.

No one uses the JKD gloves Bruce designed anymore.

We use 2 main sets of gloves (Boxing Gloves and Bag Gloves) and for those that do grappling we also use MMA or Shooto gloves.

We've found over the years that specialized gloves work better than using one set that does everything, but none of it particularly well.
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Re: JKD Gloves

Postby Angel S. » 21 Aug 2006 18:55

Jeffrey Hull wrote:Angel:

I agree with Alina and Carlo.

I would only add a recommendation for JKD gloves. Permutations of that design are made by various outfiitters, you could find a permutation to suit you. They are not heavy and bloated like modern boxing gloves. Such design gives you some independence amongst the fingers, and allow you to grapple, and let you pick up and use wasters and blunts.

Good luck,


Thanks you Jeffrey, I was using some like this..

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